Moral Dilemmas by Mr Fittipaldi https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x Moodboard en-us 2017-12-06 07:29:37 UTC 2025-12-01 08:15:20 UTC hello@padlet.com Dilemma tom_fittipaldi https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213593172 A fat man leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time high tide will be upon them, and unless he is unstuck, they will all be drowned except the fat man, whose head is out of the cave. [But, fortunately, or unfortunately, someone has with him a stick of dynamite.] There seems no way to get the fat man loose without using [that] dynamite which will inevitably kill him; but if they do not use it everyone will drown. 

What should they do?

Mr Fitipaldi

]]> 2017-12-06 07:31:19 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213593172 Bob william https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948458 we decide to sacrificed the fat guy instead of make more people drown in the cave. if it really happened we won't be the fat guy, considering of saving our own lives, we will think for our benefits.


]]> 2017-12-07 00:02:02 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948458 Arthur Su tfls_arthur2015 https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948483 According to American Law, this group of people should persuade the fat man to suicide, and then the remained people will be saved without any crime. The important point is that the fat man should not be forced by other people when he kills himself.]]> 2017-12-07 00:02:16 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948483 Antonia Su https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948524 Killing the fat guy is what I am going to choose. Lots of lives are waiting to save, at the situation there, people will choose what is the most benefit one for them, it is human nature to seek for surviving. People will clear the obstacles in front of them which stops them to survive, with no hesitation. 
- Although the scene will be so bloody, by the comparison, it is not enough to stop them to kill the fat guy and escape. It is the rate of one to a lot of lives. No doubt could be made there.]]> 2017-12-07 00:02:39 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948524 Martin Fu https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948575 It do seems that blowing up the fat guys seems to be immoral because it takes his life away and leads him to death. Murder is immoral, which is the common sense. However, in that specific scenario, the moral principle applied in the normal world might be considered unsuitable in the case above. The moral principle is created and functioned in order to make the society works better, achieving the greater good. In this specific case, people are trapped and aparted from the normal society, which means that different moral principles need to be applied. In that moral principles, it might be true that killing is not wrongful. This question combine the moral dilemma with the potential discrimination to the fat people, which is fairly tricky. 
                                       - Martin Fu 

]]> 2017-12-07 00:03:03 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948575 Ned Dong https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948687

]]> 2017-12-07 00:04:08 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213948687 Oscar Yang https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949123 In common people's opinion, they should kill the fat man. However, in the really world, it is very hard for a common people to kill a person that have no relationship with him, so they may not have enough time to make the decision.

]]> 2017-12-07 00:08:36 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949123 Jerry Jia https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949271 In my perspective, those group of people have no right to decide one's life.  Even if more people will be survival by killing the fat man, they cannot do that unless they obtain the fat man's agree.

]]> 2017-12-07 00:10:10 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949271 Wisdom Chuck Peter Jerry https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949753 First, if the people in the cave can find another place to explored and make a mouth of the cave, the people can survive without harming others’ life. If unfortunately, the suitable place can’t be find anywhere, the people have to sacrifice the one who prohibit people from blowing the fat guy up. So that people won’t be sued by murdering. Then the people in the cave may announce that someone suicide with that fat guy together; both of their deeds save all the people in the cave.]]> 2017-12-07 00:14:46 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949753 David Chen https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949798 I would like to sacrifice the fat man to save more and more people, because the fat man is so fat that his value is less than too many people.]]> 2017-12-07 00:15:10 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949798 Johnny https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949803 From my perspective, I think our decision is based on our situation. If i was that fat man, I would never accept the dynamite; while, if I was one of the people in the cave,  I would sacrifice the that fat guy after telling him the truth: he would die any way. But as a bystander, I will agree that the death of the fat is inevitable so dynamite is necessary. I need to clear that it is not the discrimination to the fat; no matter who is there, I will kill him or her i]]> 2017-12-07 00:15:12 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213949803 Karida Liang https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213951251 They prefer to burst the man with the only dynamite and all of the individuals can run survive themselves with a high portability. However, the fat man also staying with painful because of the blocking with his body in this small hole. Therefore, there is no better way to stop this fat man’s painful life as soon as possible than watch all people till die.  ]]> 2017-12-07 00:26:11 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/213951251 Crystal Gong https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214007081 To my perspective, that group of people should use dynamite to help them get out of the cave. Although killing the fat man is immoral, leave him in the mouth of that cave will cause the death of a group of people. If the rest of the people kill the fat man, they will survive. As a result, I think it's reasonable and logical to kill the fat man by explosion. Killing a single person instead of a group of people can effectively reduce looses.

]]> 2017-12-07 08:24:34 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214007081 Jerry Liu https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214781938 When this condition happens, most of the victims will sacrifice the fat man for their own survival. That is human nature. Also, human also have a mind that if one sacrifice can save a lot of people, the way that they sacrifice is moral. In my opinion, under an extremely bad condition, everyone wants to survive, so that they may do some extreme action, such as killing others for his or her own survival, including me. We are just normal human not the man who is self-giving. Self-giving person is not rare, such as most of soldiers. They fight for their country and their people. Maybe only when 10 loyal soldiers stay with the fat man, the fat man will survive.]]> 2017-12-10 10:45:55 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214781938 Ellen Weng https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214894094 In my opinion, people do not have the right to put someone to death, unless someone broke the law. The important point of this dilemma is the fat man. I t should depend on the thought of the fat man. The best outcome is that the fat man chooses to death by himself to save the group of people. If the fat man does not willing to suicide, the other group should not wait to drown. Maybe they should use a stick of dynamite to explode another way to get out of the cave. Before kill the people, people should find various ways to get our of cave. The worst outcome is that someone die.]]> 2017-12-11 04:48:45 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214894094 Chuck https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214902549 In my opinion, any kinds of loss of lives should be prevented. If I were there, I would find a flaw of the cave. So that I am able to explore the dynamite without killing the fat man. However, If it does not work. I would suggest everyone to vote. No offense for the fat people, I still think that most people would choose to sacrifice the man in a similar situation. Those people are innocent too. They should not give up their lives because of other's fault. Thus, I think they should use the dynamite if left with no choice]]> 2017-12-11 06:27:03 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214902549 Eileen Zhang https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214904168 In my opinion, people in the cave should look for some other places to explore at first. Since someone has brought dynamite with him, people could burst the cave at a particular place and make a mouth. Therefore, people could go out of the cave and ask for help to unstick the fat man. All of the people in the group survived without killing any other people’s life. However, if that particular place could not be found and bursted, the only way to save people is kill that fat man by using dynamite to make a mouth. It is immoral to kill someone, because everyone has their rights for deciding whether to live or to die. But it turns to be moral when sacrifice one person in order to save more people’s lives. All of the rest of people would survived if people use dynamite on the fat man. If not burst the fat man, everyone except the fat man would be dead. ]]> 2017-12-11 06:45:13 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214904168 Jerry Jia（continue writing） https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214904258 The value of life cannot be measured in quantity.  In that case, those group of people cannot sacrifice one's life to save their life. A man's life and death can only be decided by himself and the law. The law is based on the standards of morality and justice to judge a person's right to live. Without law, no one is able to decide others' life.]]> 2017-12-11 06:46:08 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214904258 Ned Dong https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214905237     I think they should not sacrifice the fat man to keep them alive. Because that fat man is also an human,  he also has his own feeling, thus, unless he is willing to sacrifice himself on his own, others may not force him to do that.
But when this case happens in real, this method is hard to be apply. Because every human has the instinct to keep himself or herself alive, as a result, others may force that fat man to suicide.]]> 2017-12-11 06:58:19 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214905237 Nelly Lee https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214905706 I still want to separate this question into two different positions, because the question only points out the short time, but not explain the exact number of time. First of all, if they are not in danger immediately, they can cut the fat man’s arms or get the fat out of him, which can at least keep everyone alive. However, if the time is not enough for the people under the hole, they can kill the fat man or convince the fat man to suicide, because this method can save the largest number of people. ]]> 2017-12-11 07:03:32 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214905706 Jane W https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214984980 According to this survival question, I consider the better solution, which is also beneficial, is to rescue more people as many as possible. There are only two choices, one is all the inside people wait for death, and only the fat man survive. The other is that inside people use dynamite to kill the fat man and escape from the cave before the high tide comes. If there’s no other way, and let me to choose between the two, I prefer the second one, because although the fat man survives after the high tide luckily, he’s unable to maintain his life for a long time if no one discovers him, because he is stuck at the mouth of the cave that he can’t move, and he will die without fresh water and food. Therefore, the first choice actually makes all people die, which include the fat man. Survival questions usually have no best solution, because we could not make all people who are involved in survival troubles survive, and we should explore a better solution which makes sure more people’s survival. Thus killing the fat man could be the better decision. ]]> 2017-12-11 13:02:04 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/214984980 Elena Wang https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215271690 From my point of view, I prefer to save the most of people but sacrifice the fat man’s life. I have to say that every person’s life is precious, but we have to make a comprehensive decision under this condition. Obviously, saving more people compared with just saving just one person is more reasonable. What's more, I think it is worthwhile sacrifice one people's life to save all the people. ]]> 2017-12-12 03:10:34 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215271690 Well, I choose to kill the fat person under this condition. The reason I choose to do that because this way could save more people's live. So that, more and more people could go back to their home. But we should consider one condition that is the healthy conditions of those people who blocked by the fat person. If those people are children and eler people, they have no ability to keep survive on their own. Meanwhile, if you choose to make the fat person alive, you choose to cut down his legs or arms and all of them could survive, it hurts the fat person's self-esteem. He might feel self-abased and deflated in his future life, it isn't a good solution. So, kill and respect him. https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215273949 Morrison Li]]> 2017-12-12 03:34:05 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215273949 Sunny https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215274926 We can analyze this issue from three perspective-the fact person, other people in the cave and people in the society. 
From the fat person, people cannot kill him because nobody have the rights and power to any life. Thus, people need to respect to his decision. If we analyze this issue form the perspective if those people who in the cave and cannot go outside because the fat person stuffed up the only way of the cave. the water comes in and all the people are in the feared. They know that if they cannot leave this cave they will die. At this situation, they desire of live will motivate them to kill that fat person. Killing one person and saving lots of person seems right. This question is very similar to the question that you are a train driver but your train have some problems and cannot be stopped. there are two road you can go. However, you need to make a choice which kill one person in this road or kill another five people in another road. Actually, most people will chose kill one person because it can reduce the death rate. From the perspective of those people in the society may hold different opinions from this issue. Some people may abuse those people who kill that fat person. The only thing those people can do is keep this secret. Thus, they can get away from murders. ]]> 2017-12-12 03:45:28 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215274926 Karlli https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215656675 Personal comments to this thing:
If I meet this situtation that such a fat man even can stuck the top of  cave, I will definitely use bomb to kill him because there are many people need to survive. And also, even if the fat man alive, he only can attach fresh air, but not foods or drinking water, so he will absolutely die after the people in the cave. Sometimes we need to consider the importance between two things and drop one of them. ]]> 2017-12-13 01:48:57 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/215656675 Antonia's comment on others Eileen’s opinion impressed a lot. I have never came up with the idea that to use the dynamite to explode another part of the cave without killing people. It is a really wise way, when I face the situation, I get used to choose to sacrifice one life to save others. It is really a bad way to help people out with killing. I should come up with the idea which could make the hurting possibility the lowest. Really impressed me a lot. https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/216015670 2017-12-14 00:11:25 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/216015670 Ivy https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/216017264 I believe there is another way to save all the people in this cave. If that fat guy stuck his head in the mouth of that cave, the other people can pull him inward, because it is easier to pull him inside rather than outside. Once that fat guy are successfully pulled out, other people can go outside first and find police to blow the entrance of the cave. Therefore the fat man can be saved. ( Before the rising tide, the fat guy can reach his head out of the cave again to survive from the tide.) But if they cannot pull the fat man's head out, there is no way to save the fat man anymore. There are 2 possibility, the first one is: other people will use the dynamite to  kill the fat man in order to save their own lives; the second option is: If all the people are very kind and do not willing to kill the fat man, they would rather die together. When the tide comes, people in the cave will die first and the fat man will survive for longer time. But he will definitely die later because there is no food.]]> 2017-12-14 00:32:13 UTC https://padlet.com/tom_fittipaldi/stfizdg7yr0x/wish/216017264