https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh Post plot details and quotations from The Penelopiad that support or refute the idea that Penelope cheated on Odysseus. Under each quotation and plot detail explain HOW this detail or quote supports OR denies the idea that Penelope cheated on Odysseus. This Padlet allows you to connect the ideas that support cheating and those that argue against it. Focus first on our most recent reading, and then look farther back in the novel. I expect at least three (3) unique contributions from each group. INCLUDE THE NAMES OF YOUR GROUP MEMBERS IN YOUR POSTS. en-us 2022-02-28 18:18:01 UTC 2022-03-22 04:54:39 UTC hello@padlet.com https://padlet-uploads.storage.googleapis.com/670741936/ea8a22877c6707228c6aedeac5daa080/unnamed.jpg katherineward24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070283208 (1)"Did he assume I'd dry up like a raisin?"p.116 by Penelope
This quote supports the idea that Penelope cheated on Odysseus because she's essentially saying, "Why should I stay loyal if he isn't."]]> 2022-02-28 20:43:33 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070283208 siennaalaniscorteza24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070283422 -"If the word got around about his post, said Odysseus in a mock-sinister manner, he would know I'd been sleeping with some other man, and then - he said, frowning at me in what was supposed to be a playful way - he would be very cross indeed, and he would have to chop me into little pieces with his sword or hang me from the roof beam." (57) "Actually I was really frightened." (57) This quotation said by Penelope knows that Odysseus means what he said and she was genuinely frightened of Odysseus. She would be too scared to take the risk of cheating on him. ]]> 2022-02-28 20:43:44 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070283422 katherineward24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070284782 (2)"The two of us were, by our own admission proficient and shameless liars of long standing. It's a wonder either one of us believed a word the other said." p.134 by Penelope
This quote supports the idea that Penelope did cheat. She herself is wondering how Odysseus believed her because she lies a lot. ]]> 2022-02-28 20:44:56 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070284782 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070285037 "Oh then, dear Nurse, it's really up to you To save me, and Odysseus' honour too!" pg. 117
Though this chapter was said by the Maids, that doesn't mean it's far from the truth. This shows that Penelope was truly quite the selfish person because when she does something wrong, such as sleep with the suitors, she needs other people to suffer for her wrong doings. She needed the people who knew about her infidelity, to be silenced, even if that meant in a severe way.]]> 2022-02-28 20:45:09 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070285037 katherineward24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070285352 (3)"Word has it that Penelope the prissy, was when it came to sex, no shrinking sissy." p. 115 by the maids
This quote supports the idea that maybe she didn't cheat. It is explicitly saying "word has it" which means its a rumor.]]> 2022-02-28 20:45:26 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2070285352 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2072763125 "Only the twelve, my lady, who assisted, know that the Suitors you have not resisted. They smuggled lovers in and out all night;" (pg. 117) This quotes was said by Eurycleia in the maids' play. This quote supports the idea that Penelope could have cheated on Odysseus because the maids that presented this play are the same ones who helped Penelope with her affairs. The maids are the ones who would know the truth on whether or not she cheated on him with the suitors while Odysseus was away. ]]> 2022-03-02 03:30:49 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2072763125 siennaalaniscorteza24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2072860658 "I have to admit that I occasionally daydreamed about which one I would rather go to bed with, if it came to that" (81). This quote shows how severe the loneliness has affected Penelope to the point where she would sleep with one of the Suitors. Her doubt of Odysseus not returning plays a big role in Penelope's faithfulness and loyalty towards him.]]> 2022-03-02 04:44:00 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2072860658 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073014730 1. "Word has it that Penelope the prissy, was when it came to sex, no shrinking sissy" p.115
This quote shows evidence that Penelope has cheated based on rumors heard around the palace.]]> 2022-03-02 06:57:10 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073014730 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073067310 "The two of us were -- by our own admission -- proficient and shameless liars of long standing. It's a wonder either of us believed a word the other said." pg. 134
Here, it's interesting she is talking about the lies they told each other considering in the paragraph above she had been talking about how she told him she would never betray him in his "gigantic bed" with a "wondrous bedpost". So, here, she is under the table admitting to her lies and infidelity by telling us that he and she lie to each other and giving us an example of her lies. Her "faithfulness". ]]> 2022-03-02 07:37:07 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073067310 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073085570 "He'll chop me up for tending to my desire." pg. 116
Again, though the maids are reciting this chapter, they are just presenting from what they perceived, and this line doesn't seem like something you can really come up with. There has to be some type of truth behind what the maids are seeing to saying. You can see that the maids had seen her "tending" to what was necessary for her to keep sane. ]]> 2022-03-02 07:49:02 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2073085570 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074135881 2. "Did he assume I'd dry up like a raisin?" p. 116 This quote is basically saying that how would he assume she would stay loyal for the 20 years he was away. She makes it seem unreasonable, especially living with all the suitors in the house.

]]> 2022-03-02 18:10:20 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074135881 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074136468 3. "I have to admit that I occasionally daydreamed about which one I would go to bed with if it came to that"p. 81 This quote shows how Penelope was losing hope in Odysseus' return. She was extremely lonely in these hard times and can show that there may be some form of unloyalty to Odysseus while he was away.]]> 2022-03-02 18:10:40 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074136468 isabelaguerrero24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074138659 "He'll chop me up for teniding my desire" (116)


The maids had said that they were sure Penelope had been cheating and as they keep saying that she had been with someone else. Penelope must have done something to give them the impression that she cheated.]]> 2022-03-02 18:11:54 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074138659 isabelaguerrero24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074147776 "It would reassure Odysseus to know I hadnt been throwing myself into the arms of every man who'd turned up claiming to be him" (132)

- Penelope had seemed to act like she had not cheated and due to the effort that she has put into trying to find Odysseus and how much she had been missing him along with how scared she was of Odysseus hurting her if she did cheat, I dont think Penelope would cheat knowing she felt that way.]]> 2022-03-02 18:16:51 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074147776 isabelaguerrero24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074152014 "I have to admit that I occasionally daydreamed about which one I wold rather go to bed with, if it came to that" (81)

- This shows that at some point Penelope did loose hope in finding Odysseus and that she did sometimes think about sleeping with the suitors.]]> 2022-03-02 18:19:03 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074152014 katherineward24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074171733 "...Shrewd Odysseus!...You are a fortunate man to have won a wife of such pre-eminent virtue! How faithful was your flawless Penelope, Icarius' daughter! How loyally she kept the memory of the husband of her youth! The glory of her virtue will not fade with the years, but the deathless gods themselves will make a beautiful song for mortal ears in honour of the constant Penelope." -The Odyssey, Book 24 (191-194)]]> 2022-03-02 18:27:37 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074171733 katherineward24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074197512 She is neglected as a child by both parents. Her mom was not very interested in her and spent her days swimming with the dolphins. Her dad tried to kill her when she was very young. She also has no siblings except her older sister who she doesn't seem close to. This would make her attached to people who show her any sort of love because she didn't get much love as a child.]]> 2022-03-02 18:41:11 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074197512 isabellavaldivia24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074203521 "I knew he was tricky and a liar, I just didn't think he would play his tricks and try out his lies on me. Hadn't I been faithful? Hadn't I waited, and waited, and waited, despite the temptation-almost the compulsion-to do otherwise? And what did I amount to, once the official version gained ground? An edifying legend. A stick used to beat other women around. Why couldn't they be as considerate, as trustworthy, as all-suffering as I had been? That was the line they took, the singers, the yarn-spinners. Don't follow my example, I want to scream in your years-yes, yours! ]]> 2022-03-02 18:44:31 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074203521 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074217017 Penelope not raising telemachus ]]> 2022-03-02 18:51:47 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074217017 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074228872 Her relationship with Helen could also be more evidence on whether she would cheat on Odysseus or not. Penelope sees Helen as competition and envies her. Even her own husband tried to marry Helen but failed. Penelope was only the second option to him. So knowing how Odysseus feels about Helen, would Penelope cheat? Because Penelope knows that everybody loves Helen more than her, even her own husband and the suitors. So maybe she would want to cheat on Odysseus with the suitors because if her own husband likes Helen more than her, she would want to get revenge on him. But she might also want to show off to Helen by sleeping with tons of younger men. ]]> 2022-03-02 18:58:26 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074228872 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074229928 But on the other hand, why was he still-and possibly always-thinking about Helen?]]> 2022-03-02 18:59:02 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074229928 avacostanzo24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074233809 2022-03-02 19:01:21 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074233809 siennaalaniscorteza24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074245673 "....there he was disguising himself as a runaway slave and sneaking into Troy and speaking with Helen herself, who-the song proclaimed-had bathed him and anointed him with her very own hands" (64). This quote shows how something like this, especially since Helen is involved, could lead Penelope to get revenge and retaliate by cheating. Penelope's envy and jealousy of Helen already creates a problem between them, but makes it an even bigger problem because of Odysseus. ]]> 2022-03-02 19:08:19 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074245673 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074246694 "Odysseus was the guest of a goddess on an enchanted isle,...it was just an expensive whorehouse," (pg. 65)]]> 2022-03-02 19:08:53 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074246694 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074253503 If she's dead now and there are no repercussions, then why hasn't she admitted to cheating?]]> 2022-03-02 19:12:45 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074253503 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074257709 She has admitted to being a liar and that her and Odysseus are similar in some ways, one of which is lying to make the truth seem better than it actually it is. So she could be lying about not cheating. ]]> 2022-03-02 19:15:11 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2074257709 nicolettearamian24 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089123193 red = she cheated 
blue = she did not cheat
purple = in between]]> 2022-03-10 20:30:13 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089123193 ewilkinson23 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089222266 "They were all staring at Helen" 33
"It was as if I wasn't there" (on P's wedding day--because of H) (28)
"she was intolerably beautiful" (26)
"But on the other hand, why was he still--and possibly always--thinking about Helen?" (50) P talking about O after the birth of Tele]]> 2022-03-10 21:57:27 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089222266 ewilkinson23 https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089227202 "If the word got around about his post, said O in a mock-sinister manner, he would know I'd been sleeping with some other man, and then--he said frowning at me in what was supposed to be a playful way--he would be very cross indeed, and he would have to chop me into little pieces with his sword or hang me from the roof beam.
I pretended to be frightened...Actually, I really was frightened." (57)]]> 2022-03-10 22:03:05 UTC https://padlet.com/ewilkinson23/k2zjlhd0nyw0vhfh/wish/2089227202