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I agree with Ryan, in that the story was much more gothic than romantic. The book has so many uses of magic, and dark death and more depressing themes, rather than beauty and love. I also thought Ryan had an interesting point, discussing how a book may start feeling more happy and romantic, and then quickly switch to a more gothic feel to it. --Jonathan Theis

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I agree that there is romantic themes as to what Ryan stated about when Elizabeth and Victor when they went on their honeymoon. Right after this scene, it goes to a downfall of a gothic theme when Elizabeth dies and that Victor wants revenge on the monster. -MV

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I think that Shelly leans toward gothic rather than romantic.  The monster experiences rejection and that then causes the darkness of the story and the actions that were gothic js

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Gothic and Romatnic in the novel balance out,  but the overall theme is gothic as it was set in the era of gothic literature. It practically started the gothic literature era, influencing more stories like Dracula, The Picture of Dorian Gray, and Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde which we all look to as horrifying and thrilling etc. KP

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I agree with Ryan, though it was not originally something I had noticed. MP

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I think that it’s also important to consider Victor’s childhood. His parents loved him and saw him as innocent and good, as Victor states in the opening of Chapter 1. This also contributes the the idea that people are born good, not as a “tabula rasa” or blank slate. -Ryan

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While overall gothic themes are more prevalent in the novel, I think at there is a balance of both gothic and romantic themes. We seem the gothic aspect with "Thus spoke my prophetic soul, as torn by remorse, horror, and despair," we see a lot of overall suffering and gothic themes in this. However, the monster could be considered a gothic and romantic hero. He could be romantic because he was exiled from society. He is also a gothic hero because of the themes of supernatural aspects. The romantic themes in the novel can be seen in certain innocent and pure characters such as Clerval and William. SL

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I like how Ryan says that the story is a reoccurring cycle of romantic literature and situations turning into gothic, and how that makes the story more depressing and tragic in turn. GR

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I agree with what Leeanne said about what all that things the influence you add on to one another, and that leads to you being able to judge and go about your own life making your own decisions. I also agree with what Grace said about how the Rousseau theory shows through the monster. SN

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I think kishoris point is very important about how other characters can be seen being affected by society although it does make sense since we saw the creature since birth. I also think Carlins point is interesting how he compared it to paradise lost since they were made good and corrupted by Satan which is a good connection. AD

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CA^

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I agree with Leeanne. But I also think that how Shelley portrayed the monsters characteristics, I think that she believes that people are born as a blank slate. The monster was born without any pre existing judgement or understanding of how humans are supposed to act. The monster gruel began acting irrationally and began causing real damage after he learned to read, write, and was exposed to the horrors of society. His own experiences caused him to be full of hate, misery and caused him to suffer. SL

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I agree with what Tim said as that people are born as a “blank slate” because the monster started off as not knowing anything, he wasn’t guided by his creator since victor left him. The monster started to learn on his own such as language, emotions and senses in order to survive and learn how to function in the society that he is in. -MV

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I agree with Leanne and how she mentioned that when the monster interacted with humans, it corrupted him and he became the way he is now. The monster started off good and then went bad and it proved Rousseau theory right. Js

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I would say that the story itself reflects a more gothic and depressing theme wherein Shelley uses romantic ideals to further the creation of a gothic theme. This comes from the idea that the rejection of the creature leads to the darkness and gloom of the story and overall darker tone.

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Question 4: I agree with neena -LS

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I think that the idea of personal responsibility in very important to because, although both theories can be supported, neither is an excuse for one’s choices and actions

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I agree with Leeanne although there are certain quotes where the creature himself claims when he  originally was “born” or gained consciousness or whatever that he was benevolent. A few examples are on page 198. MP

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I think that Tim's argument was very good because it claims that the creature is a blank slate, because at the beginning of the story he didn't even know how to take care of himself at the beginning, or what fire is, and doesn't begin to learn emotions, societal norms, and good vs. bad until after he has learned how to survive as a progressive thing. GR

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The question of if the creature is an antagonist is hard to answer without figuring out why he is violent, and of cause the violence makes his actions, if not morally justifiable, understandable. I think this point should be considered. -LS

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I agree with Ryan and how the monster is not intentionally trying to hurt people around him, and how society pushed him in that direction. The creature never killed anyone he knew. He didn't kill victor or the de Lacey's. Js

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I agree with Tim. People are born as a blank slate and it’s how they grow up and learn and how they’re influenced based on people, their environment, and more which shapes who and how they are. KP

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100% agree with everything Leeanne said  KR

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I like what Patrick mentioned about both Victor and the creature having these negativities about them and that’s where black and white gets muddled, that’s the “grey area” so to speak because as we’ve talked about light and dark, good and evil, nothing is ever black or white, so we see that both have good intentions but have done bad things. KP

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jS*^

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The blank slate is the what I think Mary Shelly is going for because the monster truly was good at the beginning of the book but by the end he was angry and mean and a killer the shift in him was gradual and happened after he saw how currpot and horrible society was

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I agree with Ryan and Crash that gothic themes are more present in the book because Victor had created the creature that lead to destruction. -J.D

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I agree with Tim, in that people are strongly affected by actions and experiences, and are born as blank slates -Jonathan Theis

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Patrick's point about how both of the characters, both victor and the creature, can be considered more of a monster based on your morals, as they both have very evil things that they have done throughout the story. Also, mossimo's point about how victor tried to fix his mistakes by not making a female creature, and the fact that the creature didn't kill victor or the De Laceys makes the debate more interesting because it shows that victor and the monster, while also being evil, havea  lot of good in them. GR

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I agree with amber LS

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I believe the protagonist and monster in the book is the creature because both Satan and the creature try to overthrow their  creator J.D

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I agree with Tim, people are born with a blank slate and learn many things throughout experience and what they go through throughout life but also in a way there could be a way where people are born good because there’s people out there who go through so much bad stuff and could easily end up being monsters but end up being some of the best, kind people
MM

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Q1) I agree with Jonathan on how we saw Walton being the narrator in a way and not necessarily the best person to get information from. Once the monster took play, victors information was very accurate.
Us

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I agree with Caraline and how Victor is a coward under his new responsibility, but at the same time tries to do what what he think will solve his problems. We see Victor as character we should feel bad for because of all the death or bad things in his life, but ultimately in the end we understand that Victor has done it to him self. SN

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I agree with what Caraline says about how leaving the creature alone following its creation is selfish, and not confessing to the death of his brother was another selfish motive. Throughout the book we see that victor has awful morals, although he is the protagonist. Based off of the posters describing what we would call a monster, we could definitely call victor a monster. GR

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I agree with Caraline, that Victor's actions are truly terrible, and he is definitely responsible for the deaths of others. Also, I think Ryan has a great point, that throughout the book, we as readers can feel a little sympathy for Victor, however he still did some terrible things. -Jonathan theis

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I like the mention of the fact that Satan was doing good in his eyes because it brings into question the intents of victor and the creature. I think Victor is more like Satan in this aspect because he initially thought creating the creature was good for scientific discovery, and thought that making another creature would be a bad thing, whereas the creature may have had good intent for some of his actions (for example loving the Delacys), but had no intent for his deadly actions since they were out of anger, and didn’t necessarily have a purpose. -ND

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I agree with Tim. Victor is a person -LS

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I agree with Caroline and I like that she pointed out that the protagonist is not always the "good guy," despite what is often perceived by society
CBW

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I agree with Caraline, Victor was a coward. I also think that Victor probably is more like Satan than the monster and I wanted to point out that, I could be wrong, but didn’t Satan create demons out of humans? So technically wouldn’t the creature be like a demon and Victor like Satan? MP

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I also agree with Caroline that Victor was responsible for everything that has happen to his family and town, etc. from his actions beforehand. These things can also show his lack of personal responsibility which can have evil tendencies to it , which can show how he is like Satan or a monster in the story
JM

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JM

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I agree with Leeanne because she is very smart and makes a good argument. I feel as well that curiousity isn't a trait that is passed down but rather one from birth and we see that since he has to learn emotion, then he cannot at first be bad or good because he is seen as a blank slate portrayed by Shelley AD

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AD^

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Victor is a monster for his crimes against humanity creating something so horrid and bringing it into the world but he is the protagonist because the book is written in such a way where we want to like him. Victor like Satan is always chasing after knowledge. Satan in paradise lost also lets the evil eat away at him and he the whole book has left what he created take parts of him and away and at the end he is unable to be happy and Victor does have low personal responsibility aswell but he blames all his hardships on the monster as Satan blames all of humanity’s problems on god.

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I agree with Caraline, I’m sure a lot of death and despair could have been avoided if Victor had spoken up, so yes “stupid” indeed. KP

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I agree with Caraline  but I also think that Eugene was one of the creatures/protagonist in the book. They both change for the worse and even though sympathy does lie with Victor for the first bit of the book, after we hear Eugene’s side, we blame Victor. However the creature goes back to killing innocent people which once again makes him seem like the protagonist. Each of these characters can both be seen in different lights, it just depends on how they are seen. KR

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I think Sara's spot on about waltons character development throughout the story, especially because of his clear change of heart at the end of the novel, and I believe he was largely impacted by victor and matured because of him.
CBW

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I agree with grace how she said although he may be reliable himself, we also have to trust that victor is telling him reliable things since it is him retelling what victor says to him. Also I feel that it's extremely hard to remember and get down all the things he has heard from victor and not just get lost in the story so while we may be able to trust him in that he won't lie, sometimes thing may be forgotten or jumbled up or paraphrased

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I agree with Sarah :) QH

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Don’t forget to initial or sign your posts :)

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LS I agree with Sara

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My opinion is that Walton isn't a reliable narrator because though he may retell the stories to the best of his abilities, Waltons perception of the way in which Frankenstein recounts his stories would of been altered by ambition, desire, loneliness, and sympathy.

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I agree with Sara but I want to add that Walton had a close relationship with his sister and Victor so he would narrate them as they were. Also, he makes sure to cover all perspectives and all point of views so this would add to his credibility. KR

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I agree with Caraline
MM

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I liked how Walton’s development was mentioned because it is really significant that he decided to go home considering how ambitious he was at the biggining of the story and I think it’s really interesting how Victor affected him. ND

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Patrick- In my own thoughts I said they were less reliable as they passed through 4 people at one time in the short answer.
Discussion- Sara brought up a separate part that he is less reliable because his passion and science for in the way, something I hadn't thought of. Moss thinks he is a reliable character because he adds information on each story told, adding reliability, something I hadn't thought of. Grace brought up my point of how it was told from a person to a person to a person, which is why I agree with the point that it is less reliable. Interesting how Sara brought up how he matures and makes him more reliable, something I hadn't thought of. It is true he changed from Victors story,

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I agree that Walton may be gullible but I think his main point is just to tell Victor’s story, whether or not it’s true. Also I agree that over time he became more credible. He also may be exaggerating things or have gotten things wrong in his notes but then again, even as Walton was taking notes, Victor was correcting them and making sure their retelling was accurate, a quote is on pg 445. MP

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I agree with Jonathan where at the beginning we only saw Walton as someone the story was told through and perhaps not entirely correct due to this being secondhand information, but when he saw the creature for himself, that is firsthand information and completely valid and fits Victor’s story as well. KP

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In the end we also see that he agrees with what Victor is saying he probably took great interest in what Victor is saying wanting to make as little mistakes as possible when retelling the story and since as everyone saying he wanted to learn something new he realizes these important things which change his mind and he would want his sister to know why he is changing his mind about this (this is convoluted) BP