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Great points brought up by Cali and Ashley about how women will feel like a disgrace to their family if they do not portray the "womanly image."

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Ashley brings up a good point, like sons respect their fathers, daughters are also expected to respect their mothers (and fathers).

Jake
Daughters should also learn to respect parent-in-laws as they are also elder figures in their lives.

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Ashley references the text a lot in her answers.

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They used good textual evidence on the first page. Ashely states a quote from the page which brings in context.

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What a GREAT point that cali brought up in the conversation.

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Good point brought up by Cali. I agree that women were not expected of anything else but to have those four qualifications. They had to strive to meet them.

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Cali looks at the perspective of women in the past in her answer, using contextualization.

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That was a good point. Without one trait, the others may not be too strong. They all 'rely' on eachother in a way. So there's no way to truly tell which is the most important.

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Dawson prominently believes that womanly morals are important to what it meant to live as a women in China. If woman did not act as respectable members of society they would be placed even lower on the food chain.

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Shea has been trying to carry the discussion with a lot of thought provoking questions.

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Shea, back at it again saving the group from a long period of silence with a thought provoking question.

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There seems to be no good debate topic.

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Silence isn't bad necessarily, the discussion shouldn't be forced, but I do think there's an especially large amount of silence today, at least in the beginning. It's clear who's leading the conversation when it does pick up.

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There have been some pretty long periods of silence.

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They can use points like woman's place in a marriage and qualifications of a woman to answer the questions.

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No one else seems to be bringing up much discussion besides Shea.

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Shea has made good connections and I agree with what she has pointed out about how Confucianism can coexist with feminism. She's done a nice job carrying on the discussion, too.

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I like how Shea brought up the Yin and Yang information and backed it up with facts towards the question. That could be a good debate topic.

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Shea brings up a good point about ying and yang. She makes a good point about women fulfilling their roles just as men have to.

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Shea made a good point about bringing up the point of equality among women and men with the yin and yang, however the overall discussion is too slow and not progressing enough.

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Shea made a good point about how women can be considered equal to men by fulfilling their role in the yin and yang concept that was a large part of Chinese culture. There's technically balance in the husband and wife's roles.

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This discussion is pretty good for our first day, I like how they're all building off of each others' points and how the topics brought up are debatable or conversational for the most part. The group is doing well.

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This group discussion seems to be repetitive, I think they should try changing up their topic or see the different sides of things

Cali - Although somewhat repetitive, I think they're doing a good job keeping the conversation going and bouncing ideas off of each other. I do agree that it's a little boxed in, however.

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I know I'm not supposed to say anything but Judah's definition of filial piety is incorrect, it means respect for the dead not elders. Propriety is the respect for the elders.

It's respect for elders and ancestors...MP

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Judah brought more attention to the idea of Confucianism itself and the things it stands for, and it sparked a bit of a debate which was good to see!

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Michaela also made a great point about how sometimes we should be allowed a little bit of leniency with our parents because the they expect a lot of good behavior from us but our teenage minds are a lot different from theirs.

Cali - Agreed! Michaela's point here really added to the conversation in my opinion.

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Judah stated a good point that Conucianism is to respect the elders but he didn't back it up. He just restated what he said originally.

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Judah makes a great point about the respect your elders deserve and how this can relate to the ideal society.

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Judah made a good point about the perfect society and how they wouldn't have of rebelled in the first place.

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A perfect society cannot truly be defined since everyone has a different idea of what is considered perfect.

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Lilly ,ages a good point that there is no such thing as a perfect society if people have different aspects on what is key in society than it makes it difficult to create a "perfect society"

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I agree with the points that Lilly points that there is no perfect society and that everybody has there own perfect society in mind.

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The idea of this "perfect society" was a great addition to the conversation, certain things may be ideal, but it all depends on personal opinion and often times your environment. Cassie's point brought good discussion with Lilly and Judah following in agreement.

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I agree with lily saying that there isn't a perfect society. It brought up more of a discussion.

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She made a comparison to modern day standards. Most people see violence and disrespect as a daily occurrence. I agree that his teaches might seem a bit unusual in today's perspective.

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Michaela's argument alluded to modern times and allowed for a better comparison of the two times, and it solidified her argument really

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I agree with Lilly I don't think that Confucius is not crazy he just has different though and ideas that other people are not use to

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Cassie brought up a good point that Cunfucius tonight positive values, and that he also backed it up with good reasoning.

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Michaela brought up a good point that Confucian ideas Are not something hard to practice and that society today has forgotten Confucianism.

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Lily makes a good point about taking offense being sort of natural, but this is something that could have sparked more of a discussion.

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I agree with Cassie that Confucius did have good values. Respect is a major 🔑 in society. Without respect, people will disobey eachother  and violence or other unorderly disagreements would occur.

Shea- I also agree with Cassie's statement. I think that today people are more used to violence because society is losing its social expectations to be respectful.

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i agree that he was a tyrant. It's good that Darren brought up the point about how he did accomplish some things, but he was too much of a tyrant and too strict. He wasn't all bad though.

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Finally a debate! Oh wait nevermind. At least now there is a discussion going. Their points are valid. I enjoyed Jakes point that trying to force his ideas onto others was very tyranty

I love the word tyranty...is that a word?

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Good evidence, but why do you personally believe that he was or wasn't a tyrant etc?

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I agree with when Adelina said that he was a benefit to the Chinese society during that time but in modern views he by definition is a tyrent

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Ladasha had a good use of evidence from the article, but what accomplishments did he not achieve?

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I think this discussion would be better with some debate. This has been mostly rereading the text and agreeing with each other with few original thought

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Darren brought up a good point that if there wasn't a Silk Road they wouldn't be as prosperous.

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Good discussion opener. Maybe she should have started the actual discussion to show what she was looking for. But it looks like they are getting a conversation started anyways

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I agree with Kenneth on if they did not have a silkroad, there would not be many trades going on. He brought up a good point.

Ah, but did the silk roads exist because China had silk (and other items) to trade or did China's economy benefit because of the silk roads?

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Darren could have elaborated on his point of the reforms of Wu Ti.

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I agree with Adelina when she said that is brutally was necessary to develop and bring China to power.

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I agree with adelina, they definitely needed organization. She could have expanded on what exactly needed organized. They haven't talked much about what was wrong.

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While listening to this discussion, they need to also point out the negatives of the Qin dynasty. Everyone is basically just agreeing with each other.

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I agree with Lilly about the discussion. They are currently just restating things that were said in the article. They are just listing the positives of the Qin dynasty.

I agree this group was reluctant to branch out.

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Carly brought a good point with the fact that Qin Shi Huang Di was not s tyrant and helped advance China but she could have also added that through Qin Shi's rule, Qun Shi also established law and order in China and established a common script which greatly benefitted China.

Indeed, it's tough to evaluate him through our modern lens. You have to consider what China was BEFORE Qin and that was a fragmented state in constant turmoil.

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I think you should speak a little more, as I'm sure you have great ideas to add to the discussion. I cannot give you any feedback if there's nothing to go off of.

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Darren's point about what was good about the society was okay, but he should have expanded on this. Why were these inventions good? Not much discussion actually occurring... Only points being made.

A valid criticism of the group.

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Darren brought up a good point about the invention of the waterwheel. Also that the natural disasters weren't caused by Gods. This is important because a lot of other societies believed the Gods did everything.

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I have to agree that the Great Wall helped protect China from the nomadic invaders and it helped create a better state for China since they had a sense of protection from the nomads in the north.

A better sense of protection, but was it REAL protection?

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I agree with Kenneth's point of taxes helping the poor but I think he could have expanded on that point and speak about common societies and how they use their taxes.

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I agree with the positive aspect for setting standardized laws, but Jake could elaborate more on what those laws were.

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I agree that trade increased, there was a large boost of agriculture during this time, i

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I agree with what Carly was saying because the society could have been better if the high taxes were not present and thus could have been a better society.

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Desmond, I agree with that sentiment, but what about the idea of bla bla bla.

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I think Joe could have added bla bla bla to his point.

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Judy just threw shade at John. Ha ha ha.

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John makes an excellent point about bla bla bla, but I'm still confused about bla bla bla.

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I disagree with the notion of bla bla bla