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Post #11 is to the right of all the other information.

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This article talks about the proof of the Shroud being real due to all the physical evidence, as well as carbon dating. Thinking about all the evidence as a whole, all of the DNA, carbon dating, biblical text, etc, I find it highly probable that all the information is red herring. Red herring is throwing distracting information at the audience to skew them from a logical line of thinking. Once one is not thinking logically about the Shroud, I think it would be an easier concept to accept.

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A new study released last week included new evidence that links and further authenticates two holy relics that millions of Christians believe offer physical proof of the crucifixion, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. But before we explore the research and the relics, let us recall a New Testament passage concerning faith in Christ and the need for physical evidence. I mean the familiar story of "doubting Thomas" (John 20:24-29).

The apostle Thomas was absent when the resurrected Christ appeared to some of the apostles. On hearing the astonishing news, Thomas declared, "Unless I see the nail marks in his hand and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe." A week later, Jesus appeared, giving Thomas the physical proof he demanded. Then Jesus said, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

If in your faith walk you identify with Doubting Thomas, keep reading.

Remarkably, two ancient pieces of cloth, the Shroud of Turin and the Sudarium of Oviedo, are extant today. Both are revered as relics, and each bears the name of the city where it currently resides.

First and foremost is the Shroud of Turin. Secured in a vault in the Cathedral of St. John the Baptist in Turin, Italy, the Shroud is believed by millions to be the burial cloth of Jesus. It is a fine linen cloth, measuring 14.5 feet by 3.5 feet, and mysteriously displays a finely detailed negative photographic image - front and back, head to toe, of an anatomically correct man who appears to have been tortured, beaten, and crucified. Note that, in their accounts of Christ's suffering and death on the cross, all four Gospels mention a "fine linen cloth."

Perhaps it is a coincidence, but clearly seen on the body of the crucified man in the Shroud are gruesome markings consistent with the Gospel accounts of Christ's Passion. You can count over 100 whip marks, possibly from scourging by Roman flagra, and identify on his wrists and feet obvious wounds that could have been from large spikes. Other markings are compatible with what could have been a crown of thorns. On closer examination, you can spot bruises (from beatings?) on his face, knees (from falling?), and the back of his shoulders (from carrying a heavy cross?), and a large bloody mark (from a spear?) in his side. Like the crucified Jesus in Gospel accounts, the man in the Shroud had no broken bones.

Perhaps it is a coincidence, but clearly seen on the body of the crucified man in the Shroud are gruesome markings consistent with the Gospel accounts of Christ's Passion.

The Shroud, the most studied, analyzed, and tested religious relic in the world, has spawned a vast, global field of scientific study, called "sindonology," but still baffles scientists. Its mysteries are many and complex. For brevity's sake, I will only scratch the surface (so to speak).

First among the major mysteries is how the image was made. Second, what is the substance constituting the image, which can be scraped away with a razor blade? The substance is undetermined - all man-made materials have been ruled out - and only rests on top of the cloth; it does not penetrate the cloth's linen fibers. The third mystery is related to the second: Blood from the crucified man penetrated the cloth, as one would expect, but also preceded the impression of the man's image. "Blood first, image second" is a mantra of Shroud researchers. This order is logical if the "man in the Shroud" was in fact Christ, who would have been wrapped in the linen Shroud days before the electrical event (see below) that accompanied his resurrection and resulted in the human image.

The only evidence that would conclusively authenticate the Shroud against naysayers and claims of forgery is Jesus' DNA. It would be matched against the blood - type AB - found on the Shroud and considered rare.

Enter the Sudarium of Oviedo. It resides in the Cathedral of Oviedo, in Spain. The Sudarium is a piece of linen cloth, 34 by 21 inches, thought to have been used to cover the head of Jesus immediately after the crucifixion (John 20:7). Unlike the Shroud, the Sudarium does not display an image. The Sudarium contains male blood of type AB, however, which matches the blood on the Shroud. Moreover, the patterns of blood flow on the Sudarium are consistent with those of a crucified man.

Indeed, the Sudarium and the Shroud covered the same person, as Juan Manuel Miñarro, the author of a study sponsored by the Spanish Center of Sindonology, recently concluded. "We have come to a point where it seems absurd to suggest that 'by happenstance' all of the wounds, lesions and swelling coincides on both cloths," said the center's president, Jorge-Manuel Rodríguez. "Logic requires that we conclude that we are speaking of the same person."

The study's conclusion was no surprise to Sudarium expert Janice Bennett, author of Sacred Blood, Sacred Image: The Sudarium of Oviedo, New Evidence for the Authenticity of the Shroud of Turin (2001). Bennett, who has been studying the Sudarium since 1997, tells me that,

Although Miñarro stops short of linking the two cloths to Jesus, ample research has yielded staggering evidence. For example, both linens show bloodstains on the head, in approximately the same position, that were formed by sharp objects, similar to what thorns would produce. Jesus was the only person in recorded history to have been crowned with thorns before crucifixion.

Bennett explains as well that the Shroud and the Sudarium are consistent with Jewish burial customs of Jesus' day:

Another important matter is that the cadaver that was wrapped by both the Sudarium and the Shroud suffered death by crucifixion, but was afforded a Jewish burial. This is highly unusual because most crucifixion victims were left on the cross for days and the bones were later deposited in common graves.

Bennett adds that the "new research establishes approximately 20 points of correlation [between the Shroud and the Sudarium], which more than satisfies the standards of proof used by most judicial systems around the world, which require only 8 to10."

My own keen interest in the Shroud led me to visit Turin in 2010 and again in 2015, the last two occasions when the Shroud was on public display. Having written about it for years, I have forged relationships with some of the most renowned experts, including Russ Breault, president of the Shroud of Turin Education Project Inc., and Barrie Schwortz, who founded Shroud.com, the first and most comprehensive Shroud site.

Topping my list is Giulio Fanti of Padua University. In 2012, Fanti concluded that an electrical charge in the form of radiation is what likely caused the man's image to be imprinted on the Shroud. He has also dated the Shroud to the time of Jesus, debunking the flawed carbon-14 testing conducted in 1988.

"While the Shroud of Turin shows both a double body image [the body's front and back, as the cloth was wrapped around the body] and human bloodstains, the Sudarium of Oviedo only shows human bloodstains consistent with the blood principally coming out from the mouth and nose," Fanti tells me. He elaborates:

There are many coincidences between Shroud and Sudarium that lead one to think that both sheets were used for the same person: Jesus Christ. Both have been used for a bearded man with moustache and long hair who was crucified. A significant match has been found when overlapping the Sudarium bloodstains on the Shroud face: Even the two bloodstains caused by the crown of thorns on the forehead of the Shroud man show a correspondence with the bloodstains of the Sudarium.

If you have read this far but, like Doubting Thomas, still need physical proof to accept the resurrection of Christ, I recommend that you research first the Shroud and then the Sudarium. Both have survived centuries. Their markings are consistent with Scripture accounts of Christ's torture and execution. Both contain not only the same rare blood type but also pollen of a kind found only in ancient Israel. The Shroud and the Sudarium authenticate each other.

"Traditionally, the Sudarium has been considered a living testimony of Jesus' passion and death on the cross, while the Shroud's mysteriously formed image was hailed as a proclamation of his Resurrection," Jane Bennett explains, in her beautiful description of this meeting of faith and science. "In the studies conducted on the Sudarium and the Shroud, science has served to corroborate eyewitness accounts that have always been considered by many as a mere profession of faith. In this case, science and faith - so often mistakenly believed to be incompatible - have only served to enrich each another and, in the process, bring the world closer to the actual truth of the events that transpired two thousand years ago."

Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free (John 8:32).

Myra Adams - Myra Adams is a media producer and writer who served on the McCain Ad Council during the 2008 McCain campaign and on the 2004 Bush campaign creative team. Her writing ... @MyraKAdams

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The Shroud of Turin, Authenticated Again | National Review

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A new study released last week included new evidence that links and further authenticates two holy relics that millions of Christians believe offer physical proof of the crucifixion, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. But before we explore the research and the relics, let us recall a New Testament passage concerning faith in Christ and the need for physical evidence.

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This is an article explaining why the Shroud is in fact real. In this article, it talks about the scientific evidence, as well as other biblical readings. In my opinion, all of these facts may be being used to give the appearance of validity, thus portraying the red flag of proof by verbosity.

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Shroud of Turin - evidence it is authentic; the real shroud of Jesus Christ

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The Shroud is a linen cloth woven in a 3-over-1 herringbone pattern, and measures 14'3" x 3'7". These dimensions correlate with ancient measurements of 2 cubits x 8 cubits - consistent with loom technology of the period.

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This third image is yet another image of the Shroud. The Shroud is on display in the Cathedral of Saint John the Baptist, Turin Italy. This image to me depicts the reason of belief, the unexplained. Beyond belief, humans can not definitely prove that Jesus was in fact real. If we do not know that Jesus existed, then we can not be sure in the authenticity of the Shroud. This is why I believe the Shroud to be unexplained.

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This is another image of the Shroud. This image clearly depicts the face of who many believe is Jesus. This image could be seen as an example of patternicity. We tend to find patterns, or images in otherwise irrelevant photos. This image is no exception.

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This is an article discussing the scientific findings behind the Shroud. In this article it talks about the inconsistencies in the carbon dating of the Shroud. Appeal to authority is a red flag that I would use to describe this article. The carbon dating debate could be a way of confirming ones belief, or disproving the Shroud. Considering scientists, and those of authority are the only ones that can confirm the dating, we are left to appeal to authority.

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A portion of the Shroud of Turin.

Credit: I. Pilon / Shutterstock.com

Editor's Note: This story was updated at 1:55 p.m. E.T.

Is it a medieval fake or a relic of Jesus Christ? A new analysis of DNA from the Shroud of Turin reveals that people from all over the world have touched the venerated garment.

"Individuals from different ethnic groups and geographical locations came into contact with the Shroud [of Turin] either in Europe (France and Turin) or directly in their own lands of origin (Europe, northeast Africa, Caucasus, Anatolia, Middle East and India)," study lead author Gianni Barcaccia, a geneticist at the University of Padua in Italy and lead author of the new study describing the DNA analysis, said in an email. "We cannot say anything more on its origin."

The new findings don't rule out either the notion that the long strip of linen is a medieval forgery or that it's the true burial shroud of Jesus Christ, the researchers said.

Long-standing debate

On its face, the Shroud of Turin is an unassuming piece of twill cloth that bears traces of blood and a darkened imprint of a man's body. Though the Catholic Church has never taken an official stance on the object's authenticity, tens of thousands flock to Turin, Italy, every year to get a glimpse of the object, believing that it wrapped the bruised and bleeding body of Jesus Christ after his crucifixion. [ Religious Mysteries: 8 Alleged Relics of Jesus]

According to legend, the shroud was secretly carried from Judea in A.D. 30 or 33, and was housed in Edessa, Turkey, and Constantinople (the name for Istanbul before the Ottomans took over) for centuries. After crusaders sacked Constantinople in A.D. 1204, the cloth was smuggled to safety in Athens, Greece, where it stayed until A.D. 1225.

However, the Catholic Church only officially recorded its existence in A.D. 1353, when it showed up in a tiny church in Lirey, France. Centuries later, in the 1980s, radiocarbon dating, which measures the rate at which different isotopes of the carbon atoms decay, suggested the shroud was made between A.D. 1260 and A.D. 1390, lending credence to the notion that it was an elaborate fake created in the Middle Ages. (Isotopes are forms of an element with a different number of neutrons.)

But critics argued that the researchers used patched-up portions of the cloth to date the samples, which could have been much younger than the rest of the garment.

What's more, the Gospel of Matthew notes that "the earth shook, the rocks split and the tombs broke open" after Jesus was crucified. So geologists have argued that an earthquake at Jesus' death could have released a burst of neutrons. The neutron burst not only would have thrown off the radiocarbon dating but also would have led to the darkened imprint on the shroud.

Global traveler?

In the current study, Barcaccia and his colleagues analyzed dust that they vacuumed from the shroud that contained traces of both plant and human DNA.

The plant DNA came from all over the world, the researchers reported Oct. 5 in the journal Scientific Reports. European spruce trees; Mediterranean clovers, ryegrasses and plantains; North American black locust trees; and rare East Asian pear and plum trees all left their mark on the cloth.

The team also sequenced the human mitochondrial DNA (DNA passed from mother to child) found in dust from the shroud. The genetic lineage, or haplotype, of the DNA snippets suggested that people ranging from North African Berbers to East Africans to inhabitants of China touched the garment.

Still, the strongest genetic signals seemed to come from areas in and around the Middle East and the Caucasus - not far from where Jesus was buried, and consistent with the early folklore surrounding the object. [ The 10 Most Controversial Miracles]

"One of the most abundant human mitochondrial haplotypes, among those discovered on the shroud, is still very rare in western Europe, and it is typical of the Druze community, an ethnic group that has some origin in Egypt and that lives mainly in restricted areas between Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Israel and Palestine," Barcaccia told Live Science in an email.

The oldest DNA snippets (which tend to be shorter because DNA breaks down over time) are found in many places on the shroud, and come from genetic lineages typically found only in India, Barcaccia said. That finding suggests that the shroud was manufactured in India before somehow making its way to Europe, as Indians had little contact with Europeans at the time of its origin.

"In my opinion, it is hard to believe that in the past centuries, in a historical interval spanning the medieval period, different subjects - such as priests, monks or nuns, as well [as] devotees and other subjects of Indian ancestry - have had the possibility to come in contact with the shroud in France and/or Turin," Barcaccia said.

Unsettled question

But the new results don't settle questions about the shroud's authenticity, said Hugh Farey, editor of the British Society of the Turin Shroud newsletter. [ Who Was Jesus, the Man?]

As far as the plant DNA goes, "they've done a good job, and they've identified a number of species that mean, broadly speaking, nothing at all," Farey told Live Science.

The new study suffers from the same issues that made past studies of pollen on the shroud unreliable, said Renée Enevold, a geoscientist at the Moesgaard Museum in Denmark who has analyzed ancient pollen in the past.

"The plant DNA could be from many sources, and there is no way of finding the right source," Enevold told Live Science in an email. "Also, the sub-genus level of taxon that has been reached is not near enough to the species level that is needed to determine the area of origin for each plant."

The researchers also mistakenly relied on an interpretative method that is used to analyze thousands of grains of pollen in a lake, she said. In that environment, the conditions that led to the deposition of pollen - rain and wind, for instance - are known. In contrast, there are so many unknowns when it comes to describing how dust settled onto the shroud.

"It is very bold and completely wrong to use the same interpretational approach on the presence of DNA - or just a few pollen grains, for that matter - on a shroud that has been man-handled for decades," Enevold said.

Given that the cloth was publicly displayed for centuries, it's not surprising that so many people touched it, Farey added. "Apart from ruling out the United States of America as the source for the shroud, it leaves just about everything else open," Farey said.

As for the possible Indian manufacture, it's just as likely that Indian DNA got onto the object during its 20th-century testing, he said. To truly determine where the cloth was manufactured, the researchers would need to analyze the DNA from the flax seeds used to make the linen shroud, which was not done, he added.

Still, Farey said he's about 40 percent convinced the shroud is authentic and about 60 percent inclined to believe it is a forgery.

"There is a pretty substantial amount of evidence on both sides," Farey said. "So the proper thing to do is to maintain an open mind at the moment."

However, using DNA analysis and more sophisticated scientific techniques could ultimately settle the question, Farey said. For instance, geologists can now determine the origin of rock with incredible precision, by analyzing its ratio of isotopes of certain elements. If researchers can one day figure out how to test the isotopes in the limestone dust found on the shroud, they could say with greater certainty whether the shroud was ever in Jerusalem, he said.

Editor's Note: This story was edited to note that the crusaders, not the Ottomans, sacked Constantinople in A.D. 1204. The Ottomans conquered the city in A.D. 1453.

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Is It a Fake? DNA Testing Deepens Mystery of Shroud of Turin

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Editor's Note: This story was updated at 1:55 p.m. E.T. Is it a medieval fake or a relic of Jesus Christ? A new analysis of DNA from the Shroud of Turin reveals that people from all over the world have touched the venerated garment.

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This is an image of the Shroud of Turin. As you can see, conveniently placed text describing what you are seeing is labelled on the picture. This image to me, portrays the characteristics on simplicity. It is much easier to just believe in what you're seeing, opposed to doing the work, and finding out an answer in which you believe in.

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This is an interview clip with a researcher that worked alongside scientists in determining the authenticity of the Shroud. Barrie states from the beginning that an emotional connection is a potential factor in whether you believe the Shroud is real or not. He quickly states that he does not have a connection to it, and believes it is real because of scientific proof.

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Michael Coren Interviews Barrie Schwortz Who Claims The Shroud Of Turin Is Real

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Michael Coren Talks To Barrie Schwortz Who Claims The Shroud Of Turin Is Real

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This is a video clip that explains how the Shroud is real, and how it is proven by science. While previewing this clip, I discovered the red flag of appealing to authority. Scientists and people of authority confirming that the Shroud is real would greatly influence on ones thoughts about the Shroud. People tend to believe those of authority, and that is definitely present in this clip.

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New  Forensic Evidence Validates The Shroud Of Turin And The Resurrection Of The Person In It

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New Forensic Evidence Validates The Shroud Of Turin And The Resurrection Of The Person In It! UPDATE: New carbon dating was performed in 2013 and dated the shroud somewhere between 280 B.C. and A.D. 220 thus making all of the evidence conclusive! Find more on the shroud here: https://www.youtube.com/user/GoodShepard007

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This video talks about the Shroud, and the authenticity of it. There are many people that talk in this video about their thoughts and whether or not it is in fact real. My opinion on this is that people either have an emotional connection to the Shroud, or they do not. An emotional connection to an object or idea can greatly influence your reasons for belief.

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National Geographic Historical Documentary BBC

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National Geographic Documentary - is it real : Shroud of Turin HISTORY BBC

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National Geographic Documentary - is it real : Shroud of Turin HISTORY BBC

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The Shroud of Turin dates back to the time of Jesus. It is believed to be the cloth in which he was buried with. The Shroud contains the image of a full man, believed by many to be Jesus himself.