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Class Discussion of THMT - Monday Week 11

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Class Discussion of THMT - Monday Week 11

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-How is clothing used as symbolic in the text?
-What is the significance of the name 'gilead?' How is it ironic?
-Where does Atwood use irony and why is it significant?
-What is the significance of the chapter titles?
-How does Atwood use narrative to shape our understanding of gender?
-How does Atwood use the language of the handmaids to show their experience within the setting?
-Why are gardens significant in this text?
-How does Atwood show the power of language?
-Why is the scrabble game significant?
- What does the inclusion of Jezebels show us about the text and the relationships/ power differential in the text?
- What is Janine's role in the text?
-How does Atwood use the 'houses' in the text to show how different characters respond within the setting?
-What is the significance of the symbol of the 'faith' pillow?
-Why is the wall significant in this text?

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Ella - Jay's question Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead? 

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Ella - Jay's question Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead? 

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The women in Jezebel's

Although Commander's seemingly have most freedom as they create the laws once those decisions have been made they do not have freedoms past that.

The women also have choices which other characters don't
- choice of where they want to be  ie choosing to go to Jezebels
- choice of sexuality
- choice of makeup, outfit etc. small things however - Offred tries to keep her skin smooth with butter - makeup and clothes  females 'care' about and miss - in this Gileadean society- text (generalisation))
These choices highlight personal freedom of jezebels

+ no expectations of behaviour - the aunts have given up on them so they have freedom within he confines of Jezebels - within behaviour - able to speak more freely than most characters and talk normally with each other

the sense of normality which they have - the links to the past is what makes these characters the most free of the Gileadean society.
ie- makeup, names, clothes, social aspects, sexual aspects

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Marielle's response to Jay's question - Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead?

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Marielle's response to Jay's question - Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead?

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I believe that the Commander have the most freedom in the text, as he has the highest status in Gilead's social hierarchy, and thus has the most control over Gilead. In The Handmaid's Tale, whilst all the other citizens are restricted by their social status, the Commander has the ability to deviate from the expectations of his status: he is the one to initiate a more intimate relationship with Offred, asking her to play scrabble, providing her magazines to read, and taking her out to a nightclub. He does not face any repercussions from deviating his role, whilst other characters are physically and mentally harmed, or can be sent to the Colonies.

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Jack's response to Joseph's question - What is the ultimate tragedy of this text?

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Jack's response to Joseph's question - What is the ultimate tragedy of this text?

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I think the ultimate tragedy in this text is the resignation of the once audacious and vivacious Moira. This is observed when Offred meets her at Jezebel's, and listen's to her story of escape, followed by an acceptance and justification of her place at Jezebel's, "She is frightening me now, because what I hear in her voice is indifference, a lack of volition. Have they really done it to her then, taken away something—what?—that used to be so central to her? And how can I expect her to go on, with my idea of her courage, live it through, act it out, when I myself do not? " (Chapter 38, page 261 on the
cream coloured books). Moira, a representation of free spirit and Offred's hope for freedom justifies her place in prostitution/🤬 because "The food's not bad and there's drink and 🤬" (Chapter 38, page 261 on the
cream coloured books). The resignation of hope from one who's seen as outrageous and boundary-pushing (openly gay in 80s during 🤬 epidemic [which lesbians did get caught up in during lack of understanding], escapes, so on), is tragic as, if Moira couldn't escape, and gives up, the chance of any liberation or escape is symbolically low. She was the "dangerous" one tat had to get moved from the colonies, Offred or any other person has no chance.

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How does the social and physical setting influence the commander's ability to manipulate religion to enforce totalitarian control?

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Jemma - Why are gardens significant in this text?

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Jemma - Why are gardens significant in this text?

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- Garden of the Commander/Serena Joy
‘This garden is the domain of the Commander's Wife… many of the Wives have such gardens, it's something for them to order and maintain and care for’ – pg 22

- The wives themselves have little control/are beneath the Commanders in the social hierarchy; caring for the garden illustrates that Serena (and the other wives') responsibility/power is limited

- The ‘Commander’s Wife’ cannot conceive a child herself, yet the garden acts a means for her to nurture something of her own
Tulips act as a symbol (motif) for the Handmaids - flowers possess the reproductive organs of a plant – represent the fertility that many women lack. --> ‘The tulips are red, a darker crimson towards the stem, as if they have been cut and are beginning to heal there.’ – pg 22

- ‘There is something subversive about this garden of Serena's, a sense of buried things bursting upwards, wordlessly, into the light, as if to point, to say: Whatever is silenced will clamour to be heard, though silently’ pg 161 --> indicates that Handmaids such as Offred, though silenced, possess the ability/desire to subvert/dissent

- ‘She [Serena] was snipping off the seedpods with a pair of shears…she was aiming, positioning the blades of the shears, then cutting with a convulsive jerk of the hands' pg 161 --> illustrates the resentment Serena feels towards Offred who has the ability to conceive, unlike her

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Hagen, response to Jay's question: Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead? 

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Hagen, response to Jay's question: Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead? 

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Boring Answer
-Commanders have most freedom as they make the rules
-Freedom of recreation with the Jezebels
-Freedom to read and write, unlike most others; "He has something we don't have, he has the word."
-At the top of the hierarchy, not subservient to anyone, can break rules with little worry; " Tonight, however, she doesn't even get that, because before Serena Joy can speak he steps forward into the room anyway", "Sometimes he turns on his short-wave radio, displaying before me a minute or two of Radio Free America, to show me he can"

More daring answer
-Jezebels have the most freedom as they are largely exempt from the hierarchy
-Casual access to otherwise illegal things such as cigarettes (" You want a cig?")
-Able to speak relatively freely
-Can choose to be a Jezebel (even though it's not much of a choice); " I had my choice, they said, this or the Colonies."
-More freedom than the commanders as they are not expected to abide by societal rules ("it doesn't matter what sort of vice we get up to") unlike the commanders who still have some level of behaviour expectation

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Pasindu's response: Is there a male sympathetic character in THMT? Who and Why? - Twisha's Question

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Pasindu's response: Is there a male sympathetic character in THMT? Who and Why? - Twisha's Question

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"He calls be my real name" (Ch46, pg 305) - this is where Offred refers to Nick.
- Nick is the only source of true human connection for Offred. Her presents normality in a highly abnormal society.
- Clandestine in nature and thus gets away with his form of 'rebellion' through not conforming to Gileadean social expectations of Guardians of Faith
- Stairs up to Nick's bedroom are symbolic of the freedom both Offred and Nick feel as this section of the house is separate. They are able to express themselves in terms of human connections through freedom, sex, control and pleasure - things that they can't experience in their society.
- the main reason why the aforementioned points convey Nick's sympathetic nature is because he is the ONLY source of protection for Offred. No one else truly cares for her. This means that  he takes "risks.. but for what?" It's arguable that he too longs for human connection and this leads to him being SYMPATHETIC of Offred's circumstances.
- Also, Nick is the only character that is implied to have 'helped' Offred by allowing her to speak out all her thoughts to later create tapes - the fact that he does this shows that he is sympathetic of the unjust circumstances that handmaid's (more specifically Offred) face in the Gileadean era

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Netra - Response to Joseph's question; 'What is the ultimate tragedy of this text?'

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Netra - Response to Joseph's question; 'What is the ultimate tragedy of this text?'

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I think the ultimate tragedy of 'The Handmaid's Tale' is that Offred (and females as a group) never truly gains freedom or liberation from men and their power, which is the one thing she wished for during her time as a Handmaid.
- Even in the retelling of her story in the Historical Notes, her recordings are interpreted and recounted by a man.
- The hierarchical control that men still hold in the modern day is demonstrated in the way that despite both Professor Maryann Crescent Moon and Professor James Darcy Piexoto being equally qualified as professors, Professor Crescent Moon (the female) is only present for social announcements and formalities, and is only there to introduce Professor Piexoto, the one who actually presents the notes.
- The lack of respect that women are still given is further shown in the comments made
This shows how even decades later,

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What do you mean by significant? Can you clarify?
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Netra
Netra
How does Serena Joy contrast from other females in THMT?
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This would be good
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Or- How does Serena Joy differ from other female characters?
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How does Gilead manipulate and formulate  a new vocabulary to enforce its totalitarian order? - Negar's question 

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How does Gilead manipulate and formulate  a new vocabulary to enforce its totalitarian order? - Negar's question 

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Chinenye:

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How is the political climate in Gilead defined by the intersection and interplay between politics and sexual reporduction?

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Evdokia- response to Christina's question: 

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Evdokia- response to Christina's question: 

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"What symbols define Serena Joy?"

- House:

- Flowers:

- Blue dress:

- Knitting:
Contrary to motherhood, knitting is an objective that can be attained. Its cyclist nature becomes a habit for the Commander's Wife, defining her life.
"But I envy the Commander's wife her knitting. It's good to have small goals that can be attained."

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Christina: What is the Significance of the Chapter Titles (Ms Davey's Question)

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Christina: What is the Significance of the Chapter Titles (Ms Davey's Question)

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- Night: repetition of the chapter title "night" throughout the novel represents a repetitive, perhaps even relentless coming of another day in Gilead.
- HOWEVER, the night also represents the times where Offred is given a sense of freedom and ownership. E.g. "The night is mine, to do with as I will, as long as I am quiet..." Offred uses the night (the darkness essentially - as a cover) to conjure memories of her past and retain a sense of sanity, but also hope. E.g. "Sooner or later [Luke] will get me out, we'll find her, wherever they've put her...It's the message that keep me alive. I believe in the message."

- Household, Shopping, Birth Day, Jezebels: These chapter titles are significant because they represent what the gender roles women have been reduced to in Gilead's society.
- The wives/marthas take care of the household, the Handmaid's are ordered to collect shopping, the Jezebels' (although less restricted than other women), is essentially to please men etc. These essentially denote the Women's restriction and/or lack of freedom which the night allows them to pursue (previous argument).

Historical Notes: The significance of this title implies that it is a factual, removed part of Atwood's story.
- provides a distance between the past of Gilead and the present, allowing readers to question the implications of Atwood's story in our own society. "Voices may reach us from it...try as we may, we cannot always decipher them precisely in the clearer light of our own day"Are there any questions?"

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Caroline's question: How does Atwood create complex secondary characters through ambiguity? 

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Caroline's question: How does Atwood create complex secondary characters through ambiguity? 

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Why was Nick's character relevant in terms of his relationship with both the Commander and his wife?
- in terms of trust, and loyalty?

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Nicky: What is the ultimate tragedy of this text? - Joseph's question

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Nicky: What is the ultimate tragedy of this text? - Joseph's question

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- The ultimate tragedy of this text comes in the way Offred's story is presented in the Historical Notes
- Within THMT Offred is seen with the desire to be viewed as a human, or an individual, rather than just an object for reproduction
- Her narrative voice is not even given this freedom in her act of rebellion (in recording her story and inner thoughts) , as it is dissected and de-humanised by the professors
- She never, to the reader's knowledge, attained that goal of freedom of own voice
- Unlike "The A.B. Memoirs" or "Diary of P." the title doesn't attach her name to it, generalises
- "our author refers to as 'The Underground Femaleroad' since dubbed by some of our historical wags 'The Underground Frailroad'", in a way disregards her experience by continuing to refer to women with ideas of fragility or incapability

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Caroline - How is colour symbolism used to reinforce the roles of individuals in Gilead? (Nicky's Question)

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Caroline - How is colour symbolism used to reinforce the roles of individuals in Gilead? (Nicky's Question)

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- A colour is assigned to each class in the hierarchy of Gilead
- Handmaids: red and white, - "Sisters dipped in blood" and "white wings" - symbolises the
- Marthas and Guardians: green - symbolises the 'natural' role of men and women in society, places them in the same class.

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To what extent is Offred is a tragic hero?

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Significance of Aunt Lydia in the decisions made by Offred (or other Handmaids?).

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How does Gilead manipulate and formulate a new vocabulary to enforce its totalitarian order?

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Does the Gileadean society use religion as a way to justify the function of the society or an excuse to exploit the citizens' vulnerability?

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Can empathy be restricted/ suppressed? To what extent can Gilead successfully strip citizens off their humanity

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Scott - Is there any group in Gilead that doesn't experience suffering as part of the Gileadian rule? (Nicky's Questions)

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Scott - Is there any group in Gilead that doesn't experience suffering as part of the Gileadian rule? (Nicky's Questions)

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- There are no groups that doesn't experience any sort of sufferering
- Everyone, to an extent, has a restriction of choice and it is this lack of freedom that contributes to suffering
- Even the Commanders seek to escape the confinement of Gileadian rule through Jezebels
- The extent of the suffering differs between groups but it is still always present (no group is completely comfortable in the Gileadian society)

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doesn't experience suffering as part of the Gileadian rule?

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To what extent does language define identity in The Handmaid's Tale?

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What is the ultimate tragedy of this text?

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"Restricting speech restricts thoughts and relationships" Discuss with reference to women in Gilead.

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What is the significance of the ending of/in this text, and what impact does this have on the reader?

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How is animal imagery used to comment on the lack of control that Gileadeans possess?

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How does Atwood shape Gilead and post-Gilead through the use of names?

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Is there any group in Gilead that doesn't experience suffering as part of the Gileadian rule?

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To what degree is Gilead in control of its citizens?

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Is the position of being a Jezebel liberating from the Gileadean society or another form of controlling its citizens?

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Is Aunt Lydia deserving of sympathy?

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How does Atwood create complex secondary characters through ambiguity?

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Why does Atwood portray Aunt Lydia an ambiguous character?

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How do the actions of minor characters (moira, serena, marthas) etc effect the actions of Offred?

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Is there a male sympathetic character in THMT? Who and Why?

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To what extent is Atwood's  exclusion of the Jezebels from social hierarchy indicative of the potential of freedom in Gilead?

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Is anyone truly free in Gileadian society? (or as a follow up) Who would you argue has the most freedom in Gilead?

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How do the historical notes undermine the story of Offred?

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Which group of women has the most freedom in the Handmaid's Tale? Can women ever achieve "true" freedom in the text?

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Does the Historical Context show progression or regression in the Post-Gilead era?

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What is the significance of Professor Pieixoto's character being male in the 'Historical Notes'?

What is Atwood attempting to convey about power structures within the genders?

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How does The Gileadean society exercise its control over its citizens?

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How do ranks control the people of Gilead?

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How do the secondary characters deviates from Gilead's social construct through symbols and motifs

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How do character relationships shape the meaning of the text?

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Does Offred influence Serena Joy's character or vice-versa?

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How is colour symbolism used to reinforce the roles of individuals in Gilead?

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What symbols define Serena Joy? What does this say about the position of the wives in Gilead

How does colour shape the way we perceive the characters?

What is the significance of first-person narration to convey the importance of maintaining sanity?

How does Atwood utilise characterisation to foreshadow the idea that humans are the catalysts for their own down fall?

Is Offred a reliable narrator? Discuss.

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Who was a significant male character in THMT?

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How does Serena Joy contrast from other females in THMT?

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In what way does Atwood use colour to portray roles and hierarchy in Gileadean society?

Does Serena Joy have a better life than Offred?

In what ways do the historical notes change the reading of the narrative?

What is the significance of only the commanders being allowed to read from the Bible?

Is there balm in Gilead? Tell me - tell me, I implore!

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How does Atwood use colours to shape meaning of the text?

To what extent do male and female literary characters in the 'Handmaids Tale' reflect the role of men and women today?

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What is the more influential setting, physical or ideological ?