# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Aoba Japan MTSS & Troubleshooting, Session 5

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Math fact crisis: strategies for improving numeracy with Brian Poncy (Ep 29) | Chalk & Talk

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
In this first episode of a two-part series, math professor Anna Stokke sits down with Dr. Brian Poncy, a school psychology professor at Oklahoma State University, who specializes in math interventions. His extensive research on basic fact fluency led to the development of a free math program called M.I.N.D, aimed at improving numeracy and computational skills.
In the episode, Brian stresses that we have a basic fact crisis where many students struggle with basic fact fluency, affecting their overall math proficiency. They discuss his research and effective strategies for teaching basic facts and computational skills.
The conversation begins with a description of the instructional hierarchy, a tool for identifying a student’s learning stage and selecting suitable tasks, with an accompanying infographic available on the episode resource page. Anna asks Brian to define some key terms such as fluency, automaticity and mastery. They discuss the impact of his free program, M.I.N.D, particularly its implementation in a low-performing school. They also cover research on decomposition strategies and emphasize the importance of data collection to inform instruction.
Throughout the episode, Brian shares strategies used in the M.I.N.D program, revealing his deep passion for helping children learn math. These two episodes shine a light on the challenges many children face with math and highlight research-backed methods to improve math education.
NOTE: The resource page contains an extensive list of research articles mentioned in the episode: annastokke.com/ep-29-resources
TIMESTAMPS
[00:00:00] Introduction[00:03:26] Definition of fluency[00:04:40] The instructional hierarchy [00:14:27] Interventions for building accuracy and fluency[00:22:38] Definition of automaticity[00:30:24] Definition of mastery[00:34:53] Facts on Fire for Tier 1 instruction[00:44:54] Research on decomposition strategies for mental math[00:50:07] Implementing Facts on Fire: A longitudinal study[01:00:53] The need to make data-informed decisions[01:01:45] Closing thoughts and topics in next episode
RELEVANT PREVIOUS EPISODES
Ep 2. Evidence-based teaching strategies with Paul Kirschner https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-zgw6i-13b33df
Ep 3. The Science of Math with Amanda VanDerHeyden https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-bksbz-13c732d
Ep 4. Cognitive load theory with Greg Ashman https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-thbad-13cea56
Ep 17. Do timed tests cause math anxiety? with Robin Codding https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-9qahp-14aed8a
Ep 20. Reading and math: parallels and pitfalls with Matthew Burns https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-8aj3f-1508af6
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
https://www.annastokke.com/ep-29-transcript
EPISODE RESOURCES
https://www.annastokke.com/ep-29-resources
MUSIC
Intro and Outro: Coma Media – Catch it
Blue Dot Sessions – Town Market, Spindash, Cornicob
Podington Bear – Camp
Website: www.annastokke.com
X: @rastokke
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/anna-stokke-3a1b4c

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.readable_text
Acadience® is a proprietary name referring to the work of Roland Good, Ruth Kaminski, and Acadience Learning Inc. (ALI). The intent of ALI is to make the current Acadience assessment tools and materials downloadable from this website available to schools, school districts, and multi-district agencies for the limited purposes, and on the terms, described in this Educational Use Agreement. Such use, however, is not intended to and does not place the Acadience assessment materials in the public domain.

Photocopy masters of the Acadience assessment materials are available at a host website designated by ALI solely for the purposes described in this Educational Use Agreement. Schools, school districts, and multi-district agencies may themselves make unlimited photocopies of the Acadience assessment materials for internal educational use, subject to the terms of this Educational Use Agreement. No outside printing services or other vendors may make photocopies of the Acadience assessment materials. No Acadience assessment materials may be sold or licensed without the express written consent of ALI. ALI has licensed Voyager Sopris Learning ® to sell the print version of the Acadience assessment materials and to distribute the Acadience Learning Online progressive web application that incorporates the Acadience assessment materials ( www.voyagersopris.com).

As a part of ALI's program to provide the photocopy masters and permission to photocopy for free as described above, ALI requires all users to register on the host website designated by ALI, to evidence their assent to the terms of this Educational Use Agreement, so that we may document usage as we pursue additional research and development funding, and so that we may notify users when new and improved materials are available. Users should not use a prior version of Acadience assessment materials when a new and improved version of the Acadience assessment materials are available.

This Educational Use Agreement also requires that users copy and use the Acadience assessment materials without modification (including, without limitation, without removing logos or acknowledgments for contributions to the Acadience assessment materials), except as agreed to in advance and in writing by ALI in its sole discretion. Any uses of the Acadience assessment materials that are inconsistent with the provisions of this Educational Use Agreement are strictly prohibited.

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Acadience Learning Materials | Acadience Learning

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Acadience® is a proprietary name referring to the work of Roland Good, Ruth Kaminski, and Acadience Learning Inc. (ALI). The intent of ALI is to make the current Acadience assessment tools and materials downloadable from this website available to schools, school districts, and multi-district agencies for the limited purposes, and on the terms, described in this Educational Use Agreement.

# data[].attributes.body
Password:
ABOAEKC2025

# data[].attributes.headline
Teaching for more equitable outcomes: The missing ingredient

# data[].attributes.subject
Teaching for more equitable outcomes: The missing ingredient

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Teaching for more equitable outcomes: The missing ingredient

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Why equity initiatives can fail and what teachers can do about it.

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Harnessing the Science of Learning [Swain, Nathaniel] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Harnessing the Science of Learning

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Login to Erin Kent Consulting community via email or SSO today.

# data[].attributes.headline
Novice vs. Experts and Instructional Hierarchy

# data[].attributes.subject
Novice vs. Experts and Instructional Hierarchy

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Login to Erin Kent Consulting community via email or SSO today.

# data[].attributes.body
<--1) Record your takeaways and questions here!

2) Try out Acadience Reading K-6 or 7/8 with 1 student.

3) See you on October 9th!

# data[].attributes.body
hannah@erinkentconsulting.com

Background in Elementary Ed, Special Ed, Bilingual Ed, and TESOL

Migrant Educational Outreach Teacher

Bilingual Educator (Spanish/English)

Bilingual ICOT (Integrated Co-taught SPED)

Literacy Coordinator

Head of Student Support Services

English as a New Language (ENL)

New York/China

Cheese-maker

Traveler

Pun-lover

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.provider_name
Literacy Consultants & Consulting Services | Erin Kent Consulting

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Literacy Consultants & Consulting Services | Erin Kent Consulting

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
EKC provides literacy consultants, consulting services, and literacy professional learning for schools.

# data[].attributes.headline
What’s problematic about using leveled reading assessments?

# data[].attributes.subject
What’s problematic about using leveled reading assessments?

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Teaching Strategies: Cognitive Load Theory

# data[].attributes.body
Probe Generator

# data[].attributes.body
K-2

3+

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Just Tell Them: The Power of Explanations and Explicit Teaching

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Just Tell Them: The Power of Explanations and Explicit Teaching [Groshell, Zach] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Just Tell Them: The Power of Explanations and Explicit Teaching

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Transform schoolwide reading achievement through systematic implementation of the science of reading within an MTSS framework. This comprehensive guide provides over 50 practical tools that help leaders engineer robust support systems across all tiers, creating lasting improvements that drive reading success.

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.title
Effective Universal Instruction: An Action-Oriented Approach to Improv

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
This accessible volume helps school leadership teams accomplish the crucial yet often overlooked task of improving universal instruction--Tier 1 within a multi-tiered system of support (MTSS).

# data[].attributes.body
Can we go over UDL pros and cons, and when to decide switching from UDL to intensive support?

# data[].attributes.body
Thanks for the session! I have a lot of questions :)

-Why do I often see students who seem fluent with decoding but then don’t seem to comprehend anything? How can we assess these kids' needs? How can we help them?

-How can we help create predictable routines as the second teacher in the classroom?

-Is the Acadience assessment also good for math? Would it be useful for me to trial that with middle school math students?

-Would a screener like Acadience that you're suggesting be something that we use for all students, or for students in support?

-What are your opinions on WIDA? It was time consuming but I have always felt something is missing since we got rid of it, since we have such a high population of English learners. How can we monitor their English learning progress and identify students who need support with that?

-Sarah

# data[].attributes.body
Takeaway: We need to be mindful of students’ brain capacity. While UDL encourages making lots of information accessible, too much can overwhelm or be ignored.

Questions:

1. How do we balance making info broadly accessible with tailoring it for targeted support students?

2. We assess a lot in reading and writing—how do we decide the right amount/frequency so we can actually act on the results?

-Shiori

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Login to Erin Kent Consulting community via email or SSO today.

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
Login to Erin Kent Consulting community via email or SSO today.

# data[].attributes.body
We'll explore this more in session #3!

# data[].attributes.body
<--1) Takeaways and Questions

2) Try out a diagnostic tool:

--UFLI Placement Test

--CUBED

--Spelling Inventory

--Other from the Assessment column?

3) Check out further learning on the community -->

# data[].attributes.body
Any recommendations for a UFLI-alike assessment for higher elementary? Because I tried using it for G5 but it only seems appropriate for lower elementary.

# data[].attributes.headline
Comprehension, Fluency, Oral Language--CFOL (via Acadience, paid)

# data[].attributes.subject
Comprehension, Fluency, Oral Language--CFOL (via Acadience, paid)

# data[].attributes.body
Our highschool campus is in need of any learning support as they do not have a Support Teacher. Currently, they also do not have universal screeners, UDL training, and lacking documentation for accommodations/arrangements.

Do you have recommendations of Universal Screeners that allows them to check on students falling between the cracks as well as gather baseline data?

# data[].attributes.body
I had a lot of realizations upon learning “The Simple View of Reading.” I have students who can decode but cannot understand the text and I want to find the balance between not scaffolding but also making sure that the material is accessible to them.

# data[].attributes.body
Sorry for the late follow up! I hope this can still help guide our next couple discussions.

A takeaway from the second session:

I liked what you said about scaffolding up, and that tier 2/3 is an additional opportunity to practice with feedback.

Some questions:

-What diagnostics can we use to help us plan our interventions? I'm particularly looking for ways to get data to help me plan small-group interventions for reading comprehension and math skills. I'm working with middle school but I think many team members were looking for similar things at other grade levels, too. I took a look at the CUBED test, which looked quite good but also overwhelming. I could use some data to help decide what to work on, and then to test if the intervention was effective afterwards.

-How can we use diagnostic data to actually help decide what to do in small group interventions?

-We discussed how running records are not a very reliable data source. However, since the school is already using them, do you have any suggestions for how to use that data to help plan interventions?

-In general, looking for ideas for how to best use a 20-minute pull out time block to work with a small group on reading comprehension or math skills.

Thank you!

-Sarah

# data[].attributes.body
<--1) Takeaways and questions :)

2) Explore Tier 1 scaffolds + Intervention Menu & be ready to share (see Literacy Intervention column-->)

3) Let me know if you'd rather discuss writing or math intervention next!

# data[].attributes.body
How was 97% accuracy determined as the cut point? Was it based on published norms?

What happens if a student fits multiple categories like accurate but slow and low expression?

How do you expect general teachers vs. support teachers to use this menu?

# data[].attributes.body
Thanks for the session Hannah. Apologies for being less interactive today as we have the conferences. I am hoping to get the recordings of these sessions soon.

My takeaway from today has to do with "Intervention Menu" as it's so informative. I have some questions:

1) A personal question: What is the appropriate balance for a support teacher between providing necessary scaffolding and inadvertently engaging in over-support (spoon-feeding)?

2) Given the challenge of parental allowance regarding AI use on personal devices in elementary school, what strategies can educators implement to mitigate students' heavy reliance on real-time translation and translanguage tools, thereby ensuring continued vocabulary development and English language acquisition?

# data[].attributes.body
Thank you for sharing your thoughts on using audiobook / read-aloud functions in relation to fluency development. I completely agree that even within a UDL approach, students still need opportunities to build essential reading skills (not 100% depending on audiobook).

One of our ongoing challenges is that many students are not yet fluent. Without the read-aloud or audiobook support, they struggle to read independently.

Here’s what I’m wondering (please correct me if I’m off!):

In our schoolwide Reading Workshop model, students need to be able to read on their own during class so teachers can hold individual conferences. One option is to pull a small group to focus on accuracy, but in most cases there is only one teacher managing the whole class.

If audiobooks aren’t recommended, what alternatives would you suggest to support students who cannot yet read independently?

- Shiori

# data[].attributes.headline
2) Assess Option (M.I.N.D--More connected to intervention)

# data[].attributes.subject
2) Assess Option (M.I.N.D--More connected to intervention)

# data[].attributes.body
Early Numeracy Assessment Guide + Printable Materials

Basic Computation Assessment

Multi-digit Computation Assessment

# data[].attributes.body
Scope & Sequence + Mastery Criteria

# data[].attributes.body
Early Numeracy

Facts On Fire

More Intensive Intervention

-Addition

-Subtraction

-Multiplication

-Division

# data[].attributes.body
I tried to gather my thoughts into some additional context and questions for you to try to make the best use of our last couple sessions!

Our team did a lot of work the last few years to spread the idea that support is a shared responsibility, which is a good thing, but at the same time it means our jobs are not always well defined. Many of us on the Support Team feel that it’s hard to focus on Tier 2 because Tier 1 (UDL) isn’t being supported well by the main teachers. We’re fully integrated in grade-level or subject teams so many different responsibilities fall on us. This is a systemic issue though and not something we can really solve right now—so I think if I had more tools in my repertoire for Tier 2, I might be able to set better boundaries around focusing time on that.

In the MYP math/science team, I’m a co-teacher in several math classes (the ones with a wider range of levels/needs) and at the moment I’m basically being a second regular teacher in those classes. I spend time co-planning and helping prepare materials and grading student work, and having 2 teachers in the classes benefits all students—so I’m spending a lot of my time on Tier 1 support. I pay attention to the students identified as needing support and help them during class, but it’s not in a real “intervention” kind of way. I think because I don’t have a clear idea myself of how to support Tier 2, I continue spending so much time on Tier 1.

How to decide which students need Tier 2 in math? Our curriculum is not clearly defined so it’s hard to tell how many students are really behind.

Does Tier 2 math intervention mean extra help working on what we’re learning in class, or catching up other skills? Both?

Would Tier 2 intervention happen during regular math classes or at a different time, e.g. pulling out of the homeroom? We only have 3 math lessons per week in MYP. I’d rather not pull them out of other classes but it’s hard to find enough time during math lessons, too.

I also have one identified Tier 3 student who I make modified assignments and tests for. How do I balance my time in class supporting her with supporting other students?

Another question that came from the team is how can we make better use of diagnostics to improve the referral process? E.g. if teachers identify tons of students who “need support,” how can we identify which ones really need it?

-Sarah

# data[].attributes.body
https://mtss4success.org/sites/default/files/2022-02/MTSS_Schedules.pdf

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.provider_name
think SRSD (self-regulated strategy development)

# data[].attributes.attachment_link.description
SRSD (Self-regulated strategy development) PD for schools, led by teachers, coaches & school leaders who all saw ELA proficiency gains